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Post by Blizz on Mar 19, 2012 14:55:30 GMT
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Post by Beeth on Mar 19, 2012 15:34:05 GMT
As soon as I saw the words "Michael" and "Bay", I knew this would only be a work of fail.
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Post by Alex on Mar 19, 2012 17:01:38 GMT
Wrong forum.
Also, I don't want to live on this planet any more. Definitely don't want to share it with Michael Bay any longer.
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Post by Badly-Drawn Manchild on Mar 19, 2012 17:24:46 GMT
...
I have officially lost all hope for humanity.
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Post by Blizz on Mar 19, 2012 17:43:56 GMT
I had a brain fart. That's how much it's annoyed me.
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Post by Devo DrakeFox on Mar 19, 2012 17:54:20 GMT
Oh, I still want to live on this planet. I just wanna kick Bay off of it!
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Post by Juliett. Bravo. Alfa. on Mar 19, 2012 18:34:22 GMT
/me is happy that he never got into TMNT. Because even I know this is super retarded.
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Post by madhair60 on Mar 19, 2012 19:39:09 GMT
These sort of reactions make me realise how utterly out of place I am here anymore. My sense of priorities, my understanding of when things cease to be for me. This ridiculous notion that childhood things should somehow grow old with you. Be happy that it exists, that TMNT is continuing to be enjoyed by millions.
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Post by Badly-Drawn Manchild on Mar 19, 2012 19:59:34 GMT
These sort of reactions make me realise how utterly out of place I am here anymore. My sense of priorities, my understanding of when things cease to be for me. This ridiculous notion that childhood things should somehow grow old with you. Be happy that it exists, that TMNT is continuing to be enjoyed by millions. So we should be happy that a fond childhood memory for some is now about to be utterly [censored] on by a talentless world-class hack who, if there was any justice in the world, would be collecting benefits instead of making movies, just because the franchise is not "for us" anymore? You don't hear me saying that you shouldn't watch anime because it's Japanese and therefore not "for you", do you? Even if I didn't give two figs about TMNT before this, I'd still be angry because of the outlined "Micheal Bay is a [censored]ing hack who should not be allowed within 500 light years of a director's chair" reason.
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Post by patches on Mar 19, 2012 20:05:04 GMT
I agree with Stu- I was a huge Turtles fan, but that was when I was a wee girl... I don't really care much now. Surely the fact the franchise still exists and is still enjoyed by millions of children the world over is what really matters? And was the 'toxic waste' background really that good to begin with?
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Post by madhair60 on Mar 19, 2012 20:26:56 GMT
So we should be happy that a fond childhood memory for some is now about to be utterly [censored] on by a talentless world-class hack who, if there was any justice in the world, would be collecting benefits instead of making movies, just because the franchise is not "for us" anymore? No, you should just be apathetic. This won't affect the old Turtles stuff in the least. It's still going to be there. This new film doesn't make loving the old [censored] any less legitimate. Your childhood and upbringing will remain resolutely the same. No, because that wouldn't make any sense, so I would ignore it. Mock it, possibly. The Rock was a perfectly serviceable action film. Transformers was a perfectly serviceable advertisement. I don't get the aggro, there's just no point hating someone for making vacuous films. It's a film about toys, it's not going to be [censored]ing Eisenstein.
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Post by Badly-Drawn Manchild on Mar 19, 2012 20:33:46 GMT
The Rock was a perfectly serviceable action film. Transformers was a perfectly serviceable advertisement. I don't get the aggro, there's just no point hating someone for making vacuous films. It's a film about toys, it's not going to be [censored]ing Eisenstein. I don't claim to speak for anyone else, but I don't expect a TMNT movie to be a masterpiece of movie-making. What I do expect, though, is a well-made, entertaining movie. Going by Micheal Bay's recent track record, I'm not gonna get that. People get angry at him because they feel he doesn't deserve the success he has, and I happen to share that view. Though you are right (sort-of) about The Rock, and I honestly can't believe that movie was made by him.
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Post by Sam on Mar 19, 2012 20:45:41 GMT
These sort of reactions make me realise how utterly out of place I am here anymore.
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Post by madhair60 on Mar 19, 2012 21:02:34 GMT
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Post by Nam on Mar 19, 2012 21:30:28 GMT
These sort of reactions make me realise how utterly out of place I am here anymore. To be honest, when I first saw this, I thought it was Stu trolling. Then I thought about it, and besides the general contempt he has for the forum, he's generally right in his assertions. Lets be honest, what difference does it really make if Turtles are mutated pets, aliens, or even inter-dimensional travelers? It won't really affect the story too heavily, and won't really have much influence on the film. Lets not forget that A) mutanic goop is actually a really stupid origin story (it's up there with "radioactive spider bite" in terms of dumb fictional science), and B) the story is about the turtles fighting... well whoever really, not how they came to exist, that is merely a justification. It doesn't really matter what they are, all that matters is that they're not immediately recognizable to your average human (i.e. April O'Neil), and therefor have to hide. In theory, the alien Turtles could've crash landed as youngs, parents dead, raised by splinter still (no explanation as to what he is after all), and would technically still have knowledge of Earth culture, just not be native Earthlings. But here's the point, this is an alternate canon. It won't follow on from Turtles 3, it won't follow on from the eighties series, or the '03 series, or the CGI turtles movies, or from the original parody comics of the eighties. Complaining about events of this canon is like complaining that the Sonic games canon got [censored]ed when Antoine got killed in Archie, or that Chris Thorndyke really ruined the story of AoStH. Now personally I probably won't see this film. Primarily because in all honestly I don't really care too much about the turtles, but also because Michael Bay movies don't really do anything for me, and I can't see how this would be any different. However, lets face it, there's not really a lot to go on. Yes, it will probably be similar to all of Bay's other films (explosions, needlessly sexy women, stupid immature "jokes", and a plot that won't hold up when scrutinised), and yes it's rubbish that Hollywood are taking things from our childhood* and rehashing them with the intent of the nostalgia of our age group buying into it. But that's life. Money making things get exploited in order to make money, and as Stu pointed out, if you don't like it, don't see it. You still have the old stuff. Michael Bay hasn't used this as an opportunity to build a time machine and destroy the original turtles, so don't worry about it. *I say "our childhood" but it's more like "My older brothers childhood" as most these things are from the eighties, and were going out of phase when most of us were still watching Thomas the Tank Engine, and while we were aware of them, they weren't the current crop of cartoons
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Post by Alex on Mar 19, 2012 23:25:57 GMT
Personally, the turtles meant a HUGE amount to me growing up. It defined my childhood, really. I shrugged off Turtles 3, The Next Mutation and the 4kids series as just 'not my Turtles', but they all had their merits and I could understand the general idea going on. The last movie I thought was actually really good - I'd just rather have another great live action film like the first. Obviously, then, the idea of this new live action movie had me interested.
Not any more. Sorry, but I sat through the US military propaganda Transformers movies because they occasionally had giant robots hitting eachother, even if they were awful and not at all worthy of being part of any franchise, when said franchise is included as an afterthought. I like Transformers, but they're not an important part of my life and I wasn't really expecting a good movie anyway. I just can't really stand to see something that IS an important part of my life, and really could achieve at the very least the quality of the first movie, being taken through the same ringer as Transformers has been.
It's not just the change to the story (although that is contemptuously awful), it's the indication that Bay gives the same amount of a [censored] about this franchise as he did the last - that is to say, none at all - and the implications that will unquestionably have on the movie itself.
I just want a good movie. Unfortunately, good movies apparently don't equate to as much money as throwing any old [censored] at the walls and seeing how many parents can be conned/pestered into going. The latter seems to be all Bay is capable of now that Will Smith is in Every Movie Ever and Martin Lawrence is trapped in some fat-suit based hell for the rest of eternity. Excuse me for wanting a product worth rekindling my memories and stirring my wallet for.
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Post by madhair60 on Mar 20, 2012 20:11:08 GMT
You seem to be able to tolerate the execrable "The Next Mutation", and this movie can't be worse than 3, so you should get on with it fine.
Stirring the ol' debate pot a bit, but I'm bemused by these ideas:
- That Turtles has any kind of gravitas.
- That it's something Michael Bay should respect.
- That the alien thing is somehow dumber than the ooze thing.
- That an audience besides children should be a concern when producing a film for children.
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Post by ShayMay on Mar 20, 2012 20:34:10 GMT
I can't help but feel that a lot of these questions are fueled by your apathy towards the franchise. Don't get me wrong, I agree with you to an extent: it's a bit disappointing for the long-time/nostalgia fans, but at the same time it's not raping your childhood or anything of the sort. The original cartoon still exists for your viewing pleasure.
Arbitrarily changing the origins of these beloved characters to something so... clichéd does strike me as a stupid move; sure, it makes about as much sense from a story perspective, but the chemical nonsense is one of the big things I remember about the Turtles, despite my limited experience with them. I remember the kid dropping them down the drain and then the chemicals spilling on them, which strikes me as far more memorable than "they came from space".
As for Bay "respecting" it, well... I don't think that TMNT is some kind of holy grail, that's sanctity will be spoiled by the touch of this (pretty crap) man, but at the same time I can understand the frustration of the fans. Basically, I'm somewhere in the middle. I agree with Stu in that in the long run, TMNT hasn't had a perfect track record, and overall this really doesn't matter, but at the same time I can understand that people who actually give a hoot about TMNT will be annoyed by one of their favourite franchises being in the hands of Michael Bay, and meddled about with for no reason.
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Post by Ryan James on Mar 20, 2012 20:42:38 GMT
No matter how you look at it, making the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles aliens and not mutants is kinda silly.
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Post by ShayMay on Mar 20, 2012 20:57:49 GMT
Actually, them being aliens would also mean they weren't turtles, either.
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Post by Alex on Mar 20, 2012 22:02:13 GMT
Stirring the ol' debate pot a bit, but I'm bemused by these ideas: - That Turtles has any kind of gravitas. Only to me, personally. It matters to me because it was a big, hugely defining part of my life. It was the constant that survived through my entire childhood - and it was also pretty damned good too. Does it matter to the grand scheme of the world? No. Why would it have to for it be something I give a [censored] about, though? I think anyone working on any adaption or interpretation of anything should respect the source material and why it's worthy of that adaption/reinterpretation in the first place. This should be the very basic core of why you are doing that job in the first place. Unfortunately, the reality is more the cynical, real-world reason that it's easy money for lazy hacks. A good director should give a damn about his work, Michael Bay won't. That's the long and the short of it - and why this will, without question, be a bad movie. It is pretty dumb to change the origin of the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles to be aliens instead of, y'know, mutants. Does it matter that the established origin is a dumb piece of silly-science? Why should this impact the assessment of the quality of the choice in changing it? The Labour Government was a pretty [censored]ty Government when it was in power - but that doesn't make the decision to elect the Conservatives any less of a terrible idea. Why should there be an age limit on enjoying something good? If it's a good movie, based on something I was once a huge fan of, and could still be if the movie was any cop (which, like I said, the last movie was pretty good. Not great, but good), I should be able to enjoy it as a fan. It's not difficult to create something that appeals to fans old and new. We became fans of the Turtles as kids for the same reasons kids today could. I don't understand the seemingly endless assumption these days that every child must be treated as a dribbling moron with an attention span of 7 seconds. As human beings, we're the same today as we were 20 years ago - what worked then can work just fine right now if you give it a chance. It doesn't need to be twisted into an unrecognisable mess of [censored]. The most recent Muppets movie is, quite obviously, a lovingly made tribute to the original Muppet Show. Here's a franchise of puppets managing to create a pretty good movie that not only works as a good movie for long-time fans, but a good movie for the new, younger fans who may only be experiencing the Muppets for the first time. This is perfectly doable when you have someone who respects and gives a damn about the franchise making the movie. A fan, themselves. That's not the case here, and it's only going to result in a poor movie for everyone as a result. Why is wanting something to be not rubbish a bad thing?
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Post by Balls on Mar 20, 2012 22:58:54 GMT
These sort of reactions make me realise how utterly out of place I am here anymore. My sense of priorities, my understanding of when things cease to be for me. This ridiculous notion that childhood things should somehow grow old with you. Be happy that it exists, that TMNT is continuing to be enjoyed by millions. So we should be happy that a fond childhood memory for some is now about to be utterly [censored] on by a talentless world-class hack who, if there was any justice in the world, would be collecting benefits instead of making movies, just because the franchise is not "for us" anymore? You don't hear me saying that you shouldn't watch anime because it's Japanese and therefore not "for you", do you? Even if I didn't give two figs about TMNT before this, I'd still be angry because of the outlined "Micheal Bay is a [censored]ing hack who should not be allowed within 500 light years of a director's chair" reason. The past three days of my life: -XBox broke -Break-up with girlfriend -Fall-out with my Mum
Not using this as the problem thread. If I wish to discuss these matters, I will do it appropriately with people who wish to listen and that I can talk to.
Still, these are my priorities.
I loved the Turtles as a kid. Watching the movies is still moderately entertaining now.
This is not something that could possibly upset me. I don't know if that makes me weird or if it simply means that I'm 22 years old.
No one will ever care about you, me, or nerds on the internet who are still weirdly concerned about the stuff they loved as a kid. You are not the target audience. I am not the target audience.
No one on this forum, or indeed anyone who is legally allowed to post on a forum, is the target audience.
You are getting personally offended and emotionally affected by something that has absolutely nothing to do with you.
In my eyes, that's actually psychotic.
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Post by madhair60 on Mar 20, 2012 23:03:42 GMT
I think anyone working on any adaption or interpretation of anything should respect the source material and why it's worthy of that adaption/reinterpretation in the first place. This should be the very basic core of why you are doing that job in the first place. It's possible to respect something and also make alterations. You've given convincing reasons for not expecting this upcoming movie to be a good one, based on observing Bay's previous work, which is fine, but I disagree with this: Michael Bay, whether you like his stuff or not, exhibits no end of enthusiasm and expertise in what he does. I loathe the Transformers movies, but I don't think they're half-arsed at all. Oh man politics are involved now. Good thing I agree with them. But yeah, I figure they're still going to be mutants. 'Cos of... the name of the franchise. I doubt he'd change that. We know almost nothing. No age limit, just awareness of demographics. Kids don't care about the Mirage comics, or the 80s show. They already did the fanservice show, it was Turtles Forever and it was awesome. I should clarify here that I like Turtles, a lot. Used to watch the show, play the games. Liked the 4Kids show too, that was very impressive. Actually, it is. Children's cartoons are infinitely smarter, more complex, sophisticated and culturally aware than they ever were in the 80s or 90s. Comparing the two TMNT cartoons proves this. With respect - honest! - we have no idea. Nobody does. We know next to nothing about this film. Maybe it will surprise you.
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Post by Charles on Mar 20, 2012 23:26:00 GMT
No matter how you look at it, making the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles aliens and not mutants is kinda silly. Actually, them being aliens would also mean they weren't turtles, either. Now they just need to not be ninjas and be older/younger than teenagers, and we have the full set!
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Post by Matt on Mar 21, 2012 0:19:39 GMT
So we should be happy that a fond childhood memory for some is now about to be utterly [censored] on by a talentless world-class hack who, if there was any justice in the world, would be collecting benefits instead of making movies, just because the franchise is not "for us" anymore? You don't hear me saying that you shouldn't watch anime because it's Japanese and therefore not "for you", do you? Even if I didn't give two figs about TMNT before this, I'd still be angry because of the outlined "Micheal Bay is a [censored]ing hack who should not be allowed within 500 light years of a director's chair" reason. The past three days of my life: -XBox broke -Break-up with girlfriend -Fall-out with my Mum
Not using this as the problem thread. If I wish to discuss these matters, I will do it appropriately with people who wish to listen and that I can talk to.
Still, these are my priorities.
I loved the Turtles as a kid. Watching the movies is still moderately entertaining now.
This is not something that could possibly upset me. I don't know if that makes me weird or if it simply means that I'm 22 years old.
No one will ever care about you, me, or nerds on the internet who are still weirdly concerned about the stuff they loved as a kid. You are not the target audience. I am not the target audience.
No one on this forum, or indeed anyone who is legally allowed to post on a forum, is the target audience.
You are getting personally offended and emotionally affected by something that has absolutely nothing to do with you.
In my eyes, that's actually psychotic.sorry Nights.... I mean I get your point... I actually agree with you, but. If I remember correctly you were upset over the idea of season 9 of scrubs.... I remember arguing with you at the time that a new season of scrubs couldn't take away your memories of season 8, you didn't agree... I mean, a sitcom/turtles, one mans trash another man treasure etc... just seems a bit pot calling kettle anyway enough terrible metaphors from me.
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