|
Post by Mambo's Here! Look Busy! on Aug 16, 2004 21:17:34 GMT
wahey! the Wind Waker! I love that game!! The fishy dude is my fave character coz of the noise he makes! SCHPEEEE??! Its hilarious!!
|
|
|
Post by Stephen on Aug 16, 2004 21:38:51 GMT
Theme park-a true classic. Did anyone else enjoy playing it on the hardest mode, having to order new stock shipments every five minutes and doing loads of union negotiations (with the little plate of biscuits going down)? those "biscuits" were actually panckaes but it was funny when the inspector came and its little car thing would make farting noises. that made me laugh so hard!
|
|
Nemesis
Big Time Boomer
Searching Soul
Posts: 272
|
Post by Nemesis on Aug 16, 2004 21:40:57 GMT
I thought Sonics levels were pretty good and tails's were Ok and then the rest was bad and the fishing completely dire. But to find some enjoyment out of that Jamie J I give you my highest respect Actually the only real high point for me was the NiGHTS pinball table, its kinda sad really that hearing the music and seeing some graphics made me really happy but thats the case.
|
|
Tom
Ex-Hume
Hume-who-used-to-think-he-was-in-charge
Posts: 3,786
|
Post by Tom on Aug 16, 2004 22:15:17 GMT
I can't understand how people can diss the sublime Sonic Heroes, yet shower the SA games with hero worship. Just my opinion, though. By the time Sonic Heroes came out, these people had grown out of Sonic games... and console gaming had evolved too. (Personally I used to find atmospheric excellence in Splinter Cell, but now it seems old hat. Don't get me started on the sequel.) We are constantly expecting each game to be better than the last one we played.
|
|
|
Post by Mambo's Here! Look Busy! on Aug 16, 2004 22:21:52 GMT
eeh! sorry Tom, Im gonna have to disagree there, Ive yet to play a sonic game that is better tjan S&K!!! But I have to add that I thoroughly enjoyed SA2!! Id never seen Sonic go 3D before, not including Sonic 3D of course, which isnt realy 3D!!
|
|
|
Post by madhair60 on Aug 16, 2004 22:43:15 GMT
I can't understand how people can diss the sublime Sonic Heroes, yet shower the SA games with hero worship. Just my opinion, though. Honestly... what was there in Sonic Heroes that wasn't "Shoddy, poorly made and dull" as you describe SA?
|
|
JJ
Script Hume
Bit of a hack, really.
Posts: 4,902
|
Post by JJ on Aug 16, 2004 22:47:29 GMT
It was smooth, fluid, entertaining, challenging, it had depth, a better camera, an intuitive character-change system and level-up system, well-designed levels, great music, intuitive controls and cool moves. In other words, it achieved what the action scenes in the SA games did, only it did it way better. It was everything a 3D Sonic game should be.
The only real gripe I have with SH is Team Rose.
|
|
|
Post by Stephen on Aug 16, 2004 22:51:02 GMT
it was good but way too easy to complete!!!
|
|
|
Post by madhair60 on Aug 16, 2004 22:55:07 GMT
It was smooth, fluid, entertaining, challenging, it had depth, a better camera, an intuitive character-change system and level-up system, well-designed levels, great music, intuitive controls and cool moves. In other words, it achieved what the action scenes in the SA games did, only it did it way better. It was everything a 3D Sonic game should be. The only real gripe I have with SH is Team Rose. So... much... disagreement... must... keep... to... SELF! *Explodes*
|
|
JJ
Script Hume
Bit of a hack, really.
Posts: 4,902
|
Post by JJ on Aug 16, 2004 22:56:58 GMT
So... much... disagreement... must... keep... to... SELF! *Explodes* Heh. ;D Let's agree to disagree, for the sake of our health. Unless you want to meet on online Doom and fight about it!
|
|
|
Post by Ashura on Aug 16, 2004 23:01:32 GMT
ever played Vice City?
|
|
|
Post by madhair60 on Aug 16, 2004 23:07:09 GMT
No. Nobody in the WHOLE WORLD has played Vice City. What the hell is "Vice City"?
And JJ, when I get my own internet, I'll DooM you. But only original DooMs... I got Win98.
|
|
|
Post by Samface on Aug 17, 2004 15:41:21 GMT
Mike doesn’t like the look of this game: scrag ‘im! *prepares the rusty fishhooks* Seriously, man, did you play Bingo Highway?
|
|
JJ
Script Hume
Bit of a hack, really.
Posts: 4,902
|
Post by JJ on Aug 17, 2004 15:46:33 GMT
Bingo Highway wasn't that bad. Wasn't to keen on Rail Canyon, though.
|
|
|
Post by Admin Droid on Aug 17, 2004 22:51:26 GMT
Here’s #10, #9, #8 and #7...
10. Christmas NiGHTS System: Saturn
Although technically a cut down version of NiGHTS with a few good-in-theory extras, the seasonal aspect just makes this a delightful game in its own right, and one I’m probably more likely to play than the original just for the bells and whistles. The game changing according to the date was a lovely touch that more games ought to make use of. The Christmas decorations were moving too, and flying freely is – as always – a delight. It’s funny that what is basically an elaborate demo should rate higher than its progenitor, but the thing about NiGHTS is that it’s the quality rather than the quantity of gameplay that makes the difference. A wonderfully different way to sample a wonderfully different game. And everything feels a bit more special when it’s Christmas, after all.
8 & 9. Sonic 3 and Knuckles System: Megadrive
Two games rated together because, as Sega Mag once put it, one without the other is like a badger without its paws. Sonic 3 was fun on its own but wasn’t quite brilliant – and what’s this Mushroom Valley on the level select all about? S&K was lovely and a much stronger game – but no two-player option and a somewhat disappointing ending. Together, they made a wonderful, sprawling epic. I sometimes think the Sonic game franchise would have been better stopping here before it started to embarrass itself. Since then, only Sonic R and Sonic Adventure have really hacked it. The gap after S3&K, interrupted only by the feeble Flickies’ Island, said it all: this is the best Sonic game you’re going to get. It won’t be topped. Pack your bags. Go home. The hedgehog had landed.
7. Super Mario World 2: Yoshi’s Island System: Game Boy Advance
Unless you were one of these people who were close with friends who owned both Megadrive and SNES systems, or were loaded and could afford both, there’s something very strange about the 16 bit years. Two systems produced some absolutely stunning games and yet amongst gameplayers there because this tremendous rivalry. This was how it should be, of course: two systems rivalling each other not on quantity of games or the pervasiveness of their advertising campaigns (cough, cough, Sony) or gimmicks (ahem, Sega’s various ill-fated ventures) but on simple quality. 1997 was a bit like the fall of the Berlin Wall for gaming (although if this analogy means much to you, you almost certainly don’t need to be told any of this anyway). It’s only on Game Boy Advance that I’ve been able to really get to grips with some of the cracking SNES games I never got to play.
I always knew Yoshi’s Island was good – but how good! Like Sonic, there’s a strong sense that this is the pinnacle of the Mario style of 2D platformer. It’s different from the Sonic platformers, and it’s really swings and roundabouts as to which you prefer. Both are exceptional. I’m putting this above S3&K because when I put aside nostalgia – which I’m always reluctant to do – I enjoy Yoshi more. Jam-packed with secrets and treats, with inspired level designs and great game mechanics, this is another splendid Nintendo game.
|
|
|
Post by Shadic? on Aug 18, 2004 7:17:15 GMT
Wasen't Christmas Nights a free demo or something? Sad, I never got my hands on it
|
|
JJ
Script Hume
Bit of a hack, really.
Posts: 4,902
|
Post by JJ on Aug 18, 2004 12:14:06 GMT
Ah, Sonic 3 and Knuckles: Something we all agree on.
|
|
|
Post by Admin Droid on Aug 18, 2004 18:24:44 GMT
Shadic: Yes. It was quite difficult to find, too, as I recall.
#4-6...
Most of the games I’m marking as GBA games are, by rights, SNES titles. But I never owned a SNES, so these are converted classics. Nintendo and Sega at their best cannot be rivalled except by each other.
6. Mario Kart System: Game Boy Advance
Mario Kart is just genius. Cut-throat, high speed fun with great characters, top moves, loads of different modes and short-cuts and secret levels and the eternally playable Rainbow Road track. This is everything you’d expect or want from a videogame: fun, accessible, adrenaline-pumping action that will pretty much never get dull and in which there’s always something new to find. Perfect.
5. Panzer Dragoon Saga System: Saturn
With the tone and grandeur of Star Wars (before Star Wars tanked with its prequel films), the Panzer Dragoon Saga universe was beautiful and epic. Although the game mechanics aren’t as gleefully fun as the Shining games, the mix of strategy and real-time and the use of positioning worked tremendously to do the impossible: to put the adrenaline into one character strategy RPGs. Along with a sensational plot, wonderful characters, brilliant music and sound, this is a sensational fantasy epic. The ending threw me a bit, I must admit. I’m all for breaking the fourth wall, but somehow it seemed a tiny bit disingenuous to the faith in the plot. There again, the main plot got a great wrap up too, and as twists go it was a very effective one. This is the only qualm I could think to have with one of the most awe-inspiring pieces of cathode-ray projected excitement I’ve ever had the pleasure to experience: and it’s a video game! Crumbs.
4. Shenmue System: Dreamcast
Some sequels take strong concepts through to the pinnacle of their genres. Sonic 3 and Knuckles and Yoshi’s Island are two such sequels. Shenmue has the other kind of sequel. It kills me that Shenmue II was such a letdown. Or at least it was for me. I still haven’t finished it. The trouble with university is that taking three months out ruins your flow on a lot of games and so it is with Shenmue II. So my sheer excitement after Shenmue is somewhat punctured, but I still rate it as a wonderful, revolutionary masterpiece. I suppose the graphics have been surpassed now, but at the time they looked awesome. The music is epic and melancholy at the same time, brilliantly memorable and emotive. But there’s something about the simple joy of running down the street as the rain starts to fall that makes you shiver. The plot is engrossing, the atmosphere is wonderful, and the close-knit group of characters keep the game grounded in strong dramatic scenes. This is game I would classify as more of an interactive film than a pure game, and it’s an extremely good one.
|
|
|
Post by mobiusman on Aug 18, 2004 18:26:11 GMT
Congrats. shadic, it would appear you've just become a mega boomer!
|
|
|
Post by Stephen on Aug 18, 2004 18:26:54 GMT
good old sonic 3 and knux
|
|
Tom
Ex-Hume
Hume-who-used-to-think-he-was-in-charge
Posts: 3,786
|
Post by Tom on Aug 18, 2004 18:58:44 GMT
Let me guess... the top three are Sonic and Shining Force games...
|
|
|
Post by Retro on Aug 19, 2004 0:17:50 GMT
Well I can see Shining force coming a MILE away, (I know you Ed! ) As for Sonic, the only one I can see appearing is Sonic 1, as Ed has already shown his dislike for SA2, and althoguh its good, Heroes wouldnt come this high. Unless its a lesser known one. My bets are on Shining Force numbah 1! I put 20 Mobians on it! *Trampled by the betting crowd*
|
|
|
Post by Shadic? on Aug 19, 2004 1:34:10 GMT
Glad to see shenmue on there... But I very much disagree about shenmue 2 being a let down. Shenmue 2, is better in my opinon (Especially towards the end)
|
|
Tom
Ex-Hume
Hume-who-used-to-think-he-was-in-charge
Posts: 3,786
|
Post by Tom on Aug 19, 2004 17:01:14 GMT
Are you kidding? Disc four of Shenmue II is the worst letdown I have ever experience in any medium. I was expecting to learn something about the story in that ending and instead I learned nothing. Biggest disappointment in the game. Scenery was nice-ish but navigating through it was boring.
|
|
|
Post by Admin Droid on Aug 19, 2004 18:36:51 GMT
I think what bugged about Shenmue II was that where in the first instalment there was a lot of emotion and power in how Ryo interacts with his friends and family, as well as how his grief develops, here much of that is replaced and instead there are lots of gameplay tricks like the QTE and the big buildings and the repetitive minigames to earn money. It’s like the game was continuing without its heart and emotional centre.
Anyway, Tom’s nearly nailed it, although I don’t know why he expected another Sonic game...
3. Shining Force III System: Saturn
There were many great injustices in the fate of the Sega Saturn. The fact that a system which produced such tremendous games could be so short-lived and so unloved is astonishing and poignant, and denied us some of the greatest treasures Sega were offering. I thought the denial of Grandia was a pretty sore blow, and I was gutted by the decline of Sega Saturn Magazine, easily the most readable and authoritative games magazine I’ve read and not matched by any of its successors. But the Shining Force III debacle was something else.
For those not versed on the conceit, here it is. Shining Force III was a game in three parts: a trilogy, before the Star Wars prequels and the Lord of the Rings films brought them back into vogue. In the first game, you championed the Republic of Aspinia, a communist state that was just working out all that’s wrong with communism. In the second game, you champion the Empire of Destonia, just working out all that’s wrong with imperialism. In the third game, you play a character that sided with both forces and try to find the deeper mysteries running through the games. At times, you would visit the same towns and people whose lives you saved – or didn’t, items you found – or didn’t, choices you made one way or another all would directly affect the outcome of subsequent games. It was a brilliant idea. So, naturally, Sega decided it couldn’t afford to translate the second and third parts into English.
Even so, Shining Force III is a work of genius. The gameplay is as classic as ever, but there are great characters and a wonderful, challenging plot. Ingenious battles really stretch the SF formula – one has you racing across a train track before the train passes. If you don’t make it, you can still win, but a group of refugees will be surrounded and killed. Other battles split the force up. This makes the third sequel markedly different from its two predecessors and really deserving of the legacy. The fact that the second and third scenarios were never brought to British shores remains the most grievous injustice of the Saturn era. Maybe one day I’ll at last be able to play them. On that day I suspect I’ll want to revise this list...
2. Tetris System: Game Boy
No, there’s no aliens or dwarves or robots; no fast cars or ice levels or gunfire. But nonetheless, it came with my Game Boy and is still probably the most played. Eternally addictive, it’s a real classic of our time and yet somehow is often forgotten in these kind of lists. Don’t forget it. It’s a work of genius, and possibly the most naturally addictive game ever.
And finally...
1. Shining Force II System: Megadrive
For those who have heard me talk about Shining Force, this selection is probably not much of a surprise. The Shining Force series is the unassailed pinnacle of RPG excellence, and Shining Force II was the largest and most complex in the series (accepting that two thirds of Shining Force III never made it to these shores).
For my eleventh birthday I went out to spend the fifty pounds I had been given by my various relatives, all of whom had by this stage abandoned trying to select gifts for me. I purchased a rather lovely book on the Tudor monarchs, some sweets and a copy of Shining Force II. It was my second RPG: I had played ‘Link’s Awakening’ on the Game Boy and quite enjoyed it, so I was anticipating a grand adventure in the same style. Shining Force is not in the same style. In it, you gather a team of twelve and move them across a battlefield like chess pieces, positioning them against the opposition hoardes for maximum impact. But these aren’t just blobs of pixels you’re moving around, but a hand-picked force of fighters you’ve met, interacted with, trained, promoted and honed into a unique fighting force.
While most strategy-based RPGs inexplicably use a very tired system where you stand still and just press some attack buttons, Shining Force requires you to think strategically and to see the whole board of play. Coupled with a perfect plot, wonderful characters and towns, loads of secrets and different modes of play, some great humour and some memorable music, it’s simply the most engrossing game ever. For months I played it in the morning, in the evening, for twenty minutes before school, for an hour after I had finished my homework. Between the end of March and the beginning of July when I finished it for the first time, I was obsessed. Since then, I’ve played it forensically, turning it apart, hungry for every remote secret and to see how I could make each new Force the best yet. It’s never become stale. I can’t imagine rating a game any higher than Shining Force II.
So what’s come out of the list? Well, for one, I know why I haven’t bought many new games recently. It’s not just that I don’t have time or energy generally to play or get into new ones, but it’s also that there is still so much joy to be found in these golden oldies. Even on this list, there are many games I just haven’t finished for various reasons. It’s also funny to see which systems have given birth to my favourite games. I always had fond memories of the Saturn and Game Boy systems, but the BBC Micro and Dreamcast doing so well caught me on the hop.
The breakdown of the list then is 13 games for the Megadrive, 10 for the Game Boy systems (3 GBA, 1 GBC and six original Game Boy games), 9 Saturn, 3 for the BBC Micro and two each for the Game Gear, PC and Game Cube, plus one for the Mac, which I’ve never actually owned. 30 games are on Sega systems, 12 on Nintendo and 8 on computers. There are five Sonic games, four Mario games (plus Wario Blast if you can count that) and four Shining games. The list includes fourteen platform games, twelve RPGs, six racing games, five puzzle games, three strategy games, two fighting games, a shoot-em-up and seven games that are either unclassifiable or a genre unto themselves.
So there you go. Thank you, come again.
|
|