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Post by Emilybee on Apr 4, 2010 23:20:12 GMT
Most Sonic characters are abstract animals. Mario is human, but not as abstract. Also, Sonic himself is a lot simplair to draw, being just a bunch of circles and triangles more or less. Sonic's naked. Mario you draw the circles, then you've got to worry about the clothes. Also, Sonic's models for the games have changed game per game in some cases, this means the guidelines for Sonic are a lot wider. You've got old chubby Versus sleak and new at the very least. Mario on the other hand tends to have a percific style to him, he hasn't really changed much since his beginnings. His proportions are almost the same and the only difference was art style (like paper Mario and Galaxy). Edit: @aria - There are a lot of lies and properganda related the 4Kids One Piece dub. I've spent a long time shifting through the lies and facts to find out what was the truth. A little taster; not all the fans hate opinions were justified, but the ones that were usually only go so far and miss the target completely. But I've said some things so much I'm actually sick of saying them... You'll have to create the thread to get me talking again.
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Aria
Big Time Boomer
One of few stars and many words.
Posts: 410
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Post by Aria on Apr 6, 2010 2:34:47 GMT
Most Sonic characters are abstract animals. Mario is human, but not as abstract. Also, Sonic himself is a lot simplair to draw, being just a bunch of circles and triangles more or less. Sonic's naked. Mario you draw the circles, then you've got to worry about the clothes. Also, Sonic's models for the games have changed game per game in some cases, this means the guidelines for Sonic are a lot wider. You've got old chubby Versus sleak and new at the very least. Mario on the other hand tends to have a percific style to him, he hasn't really changed much since his beginnings. His proportions are almost the same and the only difference was art style (like paper Mario and Galaxy). Edit: @aria - There are a lot of lies and properganda related the 4Kids One Piece dub. I've spent a long time shifting through the lies and facts to find out what was the truth. A little taster; not all the fans hate opinions were justified, but the ones that were usually only go so far and miss the target completely. But I've said some things so much I'm actually sick of saying them... You'll have to create the thread to get me talking again. It's more about how easy they are to draw primarily. Sonic characters generally tend to follow a set pattern of stylistic choices. With a few exceptions, most characters have similar build and body, with same sized heads on same sized bodies, with similar looking faces. That's much easier to design, and more variable than some kind of human in a plumbers suit. Not only that, but while Mario has no continuity and no sense of overarching narrative, but since every plot always uses the same characters, in more or less the same situations, with only the locations that are slightly different; it makes it far harder to insert a new character. Compare this to Sonic, where there's a new character almost every game, and a load of animals running around like it's perfectly normal, not to mention a world with continuity (somewhere) that welcomes new characters to fill roles they try to create to justify the other new characters, and there's always some opening somebody can put there fan character into, be it leader of a rival echidna clan, another prototype ultimate life form, Sonic's brother, Tails' brother, Sonic's children, another sealed evil in a can, the leader of a foreign country, an organised crime syndicate from the special zone, a sinister broadcast head, police officers, evil gods, evil baddies pretending to be egyptian gods, or even main characters identical twin sibling... All of which leave more than ample spots for fancharacters, moreso than a continuity-less, series. ^ Because I didn't read this post before posting I'll just scrap that last one. But yeah, Sonic's easy to draw. I think the thing with Sonic though, isn't that it has a continuity, but that it's got an interesting continuity. Mario's boring outside of it's gameplay. ;D
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Post by Emilybee on Apr 7, 2010 10:37:35 GMT
Mario? Walk, jump stomp on turtles... Eat mushrooms. save Peach for the 1000x time... There is some continuity within individaul series titles, but overall the story from Mario 1 to the latest can be written down in less then 1000 words. Though I must admit, Mario's cartoon series somehow managed to pull a plot each week out of the plotlessness. Actaully, if you want to call the TV series only characters "fancharacters" then thats basically the best exaples Mario has to offer.
Though in those days saying that, Sonic had little plot.
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Aria
Big Time Boomer
One of few stars and many words.
Posts: 410
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Post by Aria on Apr 7, 2010 18:35:14 GMT
Mario? Walk, jump stomp on turtles... Eat mushrooms. save Peach for the 1000x time... There is some continuity within individaul series titles, but overall the story from Mario 1 to the latest can be written down in less then 1000 words. Though I must admit, Mario's cartoon series somehow managed to pull a plot each week out of the plotlessness. Actaully, if you want to call the TV series only characters "fancharacters" then thats basically the best exaples Mario has to offer. Though in those days saying that, Sonic had little plot. Yeah that's the thing with Mario. It might just be I assumed something with less plot left much room to fill a void, and draw some writer or another to drum up a brilliant tale with more interest in doing so because of the few restrictions that prevent some things, with the exception of the E rating, which most fanfic writers will ignore outright anyway (I'm not one of them and I'm proud to say that) but it apparently is the exact opposite where with something more serious about it's continuity and the bonus of easier characters to draw (pointed out earlier) might just be easier to follow. Maybe they're more interested in something easy to convey than something with more creative freedom.
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Post by madhair60 on Apr 8, 2010 12:42:14 GMT
They're interested in having an enormous audience of undiscerning people by default. This is how folks like Hogfather* got their awful, awful [censored] voted "best fanfiction". Then again, [censored]ing hell, "best fanfiction". It's like saying "best cancer", or "best infant rapist".
*If this just comes across as a bitter feud that I can't let go of, it's not; I just don't know any other fanfiction writers, because I generally avoid that abortive crap.
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Post by Emilybee on Apr 8, 2010 13:07:03 GMT
Why do teenagers not old enough for sex write fanfiction for character also not old enough for sex by law? I can remember the days where I did bother with reading fanfiction I once read a Mortal Komat comic where in a letter section someone sent in a letter related to Rayden, the God of Thunder. The editor was disturbed because a 12 year old was calling someone immortal and centuries much older then her hot. I must admit, the comments were amusing from the editor on the notion. Its the fanfiction writers that scare a lot of folks into the "anti-fury" brigade over this kind of thing. Still, nothing compares to that one last fanfiction I read 6 years ago where things just were plain disturbing. That particular 14 year old girl was just sick, I didn't even make it past chapter 1 (and I stopped because she didn't even mention that her fanfiction was on this level of sicko before I read it). In other words, she'd be a pedeophile for that kind of thing. '
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Post by Charles on Apr 8, 2010 13:15:03 GMT
Why do teenagers not old enough for sex write fanfiction for character also not old enough for sex by law? Because they're teenagers with hormones and they have access to a keyboard.
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Post by Nam on Apr 8, 2010 16:52:39 GMT
To anything, Sturgeons law applies. Sturgeons law dictates that ninety percent of anything is rubbish, based on the idea that while there might be an audience for everything, not everyone can like everything.
What you have to remember, however, is that unlike published work, where the truly bad (i.e. missspelled, nonsensical, confusing) doesn't get filtered by editors or publishers. Anyone with a keyboard can write a fanfic, so you end up with the ten percent of good stuff, hidden behind the ninety percent of stuff good enough to get published were it not actually fanfiction, as well as the millions of other things which genuinely would never get green lit by a publisher for being too badly written.
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Aria
Big Time Boomer
One of few stars and many words.
Posts: 410
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Post by Aria on Apr 8, 2010 21:43:08 GMT
Why do teenagers not old enough for sex write fanfiction for character also not old enough for sex by law? Because they're teenagers with hormones and they have access to a keyboard. You beat me to it. ;D In some countries, it's legal to have sex as early as 13, which means 13 year old girls/boys are doing things and it doesn't seem like it effect their society too dramatically so the whole 'sex' thing never creeped me out with 14-15 year olds. What I don't understand is why there are fan characters, and even canon characters under 12 that instantly are well endowed and 3 years above their expected development, why these children cuss (an adorable 8 year old fox or 5 year old rabbit cussing looks stupid.), are experts with guns, great at lovemaking and don't cry, but scoff at serious wounds. Most fanfic writers are either oblivious to this little thing called character traits / stereotypes or ignore it. @madhair: That's understandable. I've only dealt with it because I've been RPing for too damn long and get my joys from tearing apart bad writing.
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Post by Emilybee on Apr 8, 2010 22:40:29 GMT
It wasn't legal in her country thats for sure. >_<
If it was art, they'd have her after the time the first paragraph was written (after one paragraph it got nasty...).
When you tell them their writing is sick they either get nasty, ring up their supporters for a drama rally or claim it doesn't matter since its fanfiction.
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Aria
Big Time Boomer
One of few stars and many words.
Posts: 410
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Post by Aria on Apr 8, 2010 23:33:29 GMT
It wasn't legal in her country thats for sure. >_< If it was art, they'd have her after the time the first paragraph was written (after one paragraph it got nasty...). When you tell them their writing is sick they either get nasty, ring up their supporters for a drama rally or claim it doesn't matter since its fanfiction. I know. It's great for sites like this (NSFW) to humiliate them on and make them cry to their mommies. The beauty of screencaps. Because if someone is too immature to take constructive criticism they deserve to be made fun of.
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Post by Emilybee on Apr 9, 2010 7:49:33 GMT
It wasn't legal in her country thats for sure. >_< If it was art, they'd have her after the time the first paragraph was written (after one paragraph it got nasty...). When you tell them their writing is sick they either get nasty, ring up their supporters for a drama rally or claim it doesn't matter since its fanfiction. I know. It's great for sites like this (NSFW) to humiliate them on and make them cry to their mommies. The beauty of screencaps. Because if someone is too immature to take constructive criticism they deserve to be made fun of.Hmm.... Well at least it doesn't remind me of the "anti-Mary-Sue" group whose name I forget. Their aim - kill Mary-Sues... By promoting their own.
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Aria
Big Time Boomer
One of few stars and many words.
Posts: 410
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Post by Aria on Apr 9, 2010 22:26:50 GMT
I know. It's great for sites like this (NSFW) to humiliate them on and make them cry to their mommies. The beauty of screencaps. Because if someone is too immature to take constructive criticism they deserve to be made fun of.Hmm.... Well at least it doesn't remind me of the "anti-Mary-Sue" group whose name I forget. Their aim - kill Mary-Sues... By promoting their own. I might need to go look that up. It sounds interesting. I swear, if there's something to hate on the internet, there's a group (or five) dedicated to hating it. (And they all end up on deviantART ;D ;D ;D)
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Post by Emilybee on Apr 10, 2010 20:03:39 GMT
I don't even remember their name. Its been 6 years, do they even exist? They were hypocrits anyway. Oh yeah, except in the case of Sonic and co the side lines are gray and not blackened out.
There are some who hate it, but will practice it... Oh lets not go into the list. But the response to Sonic fancharacters is varied, sinceSonic is a fury and furries cover a varity of shows and franchises not just sonic.
In fact theres your problem right there with fancharacters. One could start off drawing Sonic and end up drawing Danger mouse if one wanted to.
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Aria
Big Time Boomer
One of few stars and many words.
Posts: 410
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Post by Aria on Apr 10, 2010 21:35:51 GMT
I don't even remember their name. Its been 6 years, do they even exist? They were hypocrits anyway. Oh yeah, except in the case of Sonic and co the side lines are gray and not blackened out. There are some who hate it, but will practice it... Oh lets not go into the list. But the response to Sonic fancharacters is varied, sinceSonic is a fury and furries cover a varity of shows and franchises not just sonic. In fact theres your problem right there with fancharacters. One could start off drawing Sonic and end up drawing Danger mouse if one wanted to. Well, you could say the same thing for humans. It's not entirely about the furry thing, Sonic's just varied in general I guess. Look at Archie and STC, two different things, and they're very different to the games... It leaves writers with a lot of options that some will inevitably combine and/or butcher to death.
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Post by knucklehead on Apr 28, 2010 13:13:01 GMT
I used to draw a lot of Sonic fancharacters but only for the reason that's already been said. They're easy to draw! I never bothered making up back up stories because for me they only existed because I wondered 'Hmm how can I make the trainers look cooler...' or 'Hmm what would it look like if it was a cat rather than a hedgehog...' I moved on, but they're a brilliant step up when you're young and still playing around with different styles and stuff.
When it comes to putting them into stories/comics/whatever they have to be pretty amazing before I like them. But I dislike a few of the official ones too so it's a difficult line to walk.
Official always wins for me, but once in a while you do get a fan who's an absolutely epic artist and that just has to be appreciated.
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Post by Emilybee on May 5, 2010 12:42:39 GMT
*Points at STC-Os artists. *
Hehee... STC-O has some of the best around of the fan artists. ;-)
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Post by knucklehead on May 6, 2010 10:43:34 GMT
*Points at STC-Os artists. * Hehee... STC-O has some of the best around of the fan artists. ;-) I know... I'm slowly getting through the back issues to try and catch up and some of the work (not naming names hehe) is pure and simply made of win... ^_^
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Aria
Big Time Boomer
One of few stars and many words.
Posts: 410
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Post by Aria on May 6, 2010 19:53:08 GMT
I still haven't caught up. I don't live in Britain, so my only option to get the older comics was to find a torrent, and I'm still reading those while occasionally looking at STC-O. ;D Some of the artwork in STC bothers me though. It looks weird and inconsistent through different issues. I thought there as only one artist working on STC-O? Just an example of weird looking 'fan' characters... This style's appeared in some other issues as well, once in a main Sonic story and not a side-story like this one. I don't know who's drawing this, but they can't draw Sonic style to save their lives apparently.
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Post by madhair60 on May 6, 2010 19:57:48 GMT
There are loads of artists, Aria.
I wasn't too fond of the above example either, but the variation in style is one of the better features of the comic imo.
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Post by Charles on May 6, 2010 19:59:36 GMT
I thought there as only one artist working on STC-O? That's never been the case. He's not trying to draw "Sonic style", he's drawing his own style.
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Aria
Big Time Boomer
One of few stars and many words.
Posts: 410
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Post by Aria on May 6, 2010 20:01:31 GMT
There are loads of artists, Aria. I wasn't too fond of the above example either, but the variation in style is one of the better features of the comic imo. That would explain all the different art styles. If they have to vary their art style, could they please make sure it look like Sonic and not a bunch of humans dressed as animals? I thought there as only one artist working on STC-O? That's never been the case. He's not trying to draw "Sonic style", he's drawing his own style. It's a Sonic comic.
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Post by Nam on May 6, 2010 20:09:10 GMT
Aria, it's free work. It's done by volunteers, who aren't paid, and don't get any money for there efforts. The style is there choice, not anyone elses, and they do it in whatever style they please, for whatever they want. From what I know, Smithy's work (the vichama paintwork mainly) was done as much for fancomic fun, but also for his own professional working portfolio, hence the difference.
You can't just say "It's a Sonic comic" as justification for the art style being right. Just look at some of the strips in Sonic The Comic (the professionally published, paper one, the one that got paid for). That itself was nothing like the Sonic art style.
But ultimately, this isn't professional work, you can't expect professional quality and consistency, that just doesn't happen.
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Post by madhair60 on May 6, 2010 20:11:27 GMT
Every line of that post is gold. I [censored]ing creased when I saw the final line, and then went "YES!" quite loudly.
Edit: Aria's not Nam's. Nam's is just mediocre.
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Post by Nam on May 6, 2010 20:15:19 GMT
Edit: Aria's not Nam's. Nam's is just mediocre. I'll mediocre you in a minute! averagely too!
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